Mormonophobia and homophobia, part 2

[BlueHair]

Originally Posted by SoonerCoug

As far as insects (like ants and bees)--these are obvious examples where the majority of the group do not reproduce, but their genetic material is passed to the next generation if they contribute as soldiers and workers.

But I've seen scientific literature citing many examples of homosexuality in higher animals, including mammals. Obviously, non-reproductive members of species is a less common phenomenon among higher animals.

There are all kinds of other explanations for the origins of homosexuality. Fraternal birth order definitely correlates with increased chances of being homosexual, perhaps due to maternal immunity issues.

Homosexuality doesn't necessarily HAVE to have any function. It's especially common among birds (if we speak of higher animals), but our closest relative (the bonobo) is also known to engage in homosexual activity.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/n...gayanimal.html

Below is an excerpt from a summary I wrote on the scientific literature on the origins of homosexuality. I was just curious about the evidence for its origins, and also how this might relate to our theology.

Male homosexuality is partly genetically heritable. Most evidence suggests that genetic transmission occurs from mother to son. Some homosexual men also engage in heterosexual sex, even having children. Interestingly, the vast majority of children of male homosexuals are heterosexual, further suggesting that father-to-son genetic transmission of homosexuality does not occur. In 1993, one group reported that a region of the X chromosome was associated with male homosexuality. Association with the X chromosome would be consistent with maternal inheritance, since a man receives one X chromosome from mother and one Y chromosome from Dad. However, some scientists have had difficulty verifying the association with the X chromosome, leaving this finding somewhat controversial. Nevertheless, additional studies have discovered locations in chromosomes 7, 8, and 10 that are associated with male homosexuality. One might ask: how could genetic transmission on these chromosomes be predominantly from mother to son, especially since a child receives one copy of chromosomes 7, 8, and 10 from mother and a second copy from father? The answer has to do with imprinting, a phenomenon in which a gene is expressed differently depending on whether it is derived from the mother or father.
Doll Houses and Dump Trucks
Adult male homosexuals often exhibit different behaviors in childhood from heterosexuals. During childhood, male homosexuals are more likely to have female-type behavior, and they prefer to play with girls. Androgen insensitivity is a disorder in which a child has female external genitalia, but actually has male internal genitalia (i.e. undescended testicles and a vagina). However, when puberty begins, androgen-insensitive children begin to develop as a typical male. Despite experiencing a completely "female" childhood and upbringing, the vast majority of these individuals are heterosexuals as adults, suggesting that female-typical childhood behavior does not cause homosexuality in the adult. In other words, childhood behavior and upbringing are not sufficient to cause adult homosexuality.
The Physiology of Homosexuality
There are all kinds of physiologic differences between male homosexuals and heterosexuals. It is inconceivable that these physiologic differences could be the result of an individual's choice. For example, homosexual men hit puberty earlier than heterosexual men. A much higher percentage of homosexual men are left-handed. There are many differences in brain structure between homosexual and heterosexual men. Homosexual men have certain brain structures that are much more similar to the female brain. During cognitive exams that differentiate based on gender, male homosexuals perform much like females.
Birth Order: The 9th of 10 Children
One of the most convincing phenomena associated with homosexuality is fraternal birth order. This is an environmental contributor to homosexuality, and it has to do with the prenatal environment in the mother's womb. If there are four boys in a family, the oldest has the lowest chance of being homosexual. The second oldest has a 33% greater chance than the oldest boy, and each subsequent male child has an additional 33% increased chance of being homosexual. This means that approximately 1 in 9 homosexuals can attribute their sexual orientation to the fraternal birth order.
Why might birth order play a role? As I mentioned earlier, our DNA is the blueprint for the body. Each gene encodes a single protein, and each protein has its own special function. It might be comparable to a blueprint for a machine (the blueprint being the genes), and the cogs inside the (the proteins being the cogs or machinery that make us tick). A male child has a Y chromosome, which the mother lacks. This means that male children express genes and proteins that are foreign to the mother. In addition, both male and female babies express genes and proteins derived from the father's DNA, which also have some potential to be recognized as foreign by the mother's immune system. As a result, certain proteins are expressed by a fetus, and in particular by a male fetus, that are completely foreign to the mother. The maternal immune system is remarkably suppressed so that foreign proteins expressed in a developing male or female fetus are not rejected by the mother's immune system. A large immune response to the fetus could have serious consequences, but a limited immune response might have less dramatic but meaningful effects.
You might think of the birth order issue a little like immunizations and booster shots. The first time you are immunized against measles, your body produces a relatively weak immune response. However, certain "memory" cells form so that the second time measles virus particles enter your body, a more robust response is generated. A second "booster" shot increases the immune system's capacity to respond to foreign proteins. Each subsequent booster has a similar effect. Every time a mother carries a male child, there are increasing numbers of immune response proteins--called antibodies--which are directed against certain proteins unique to the male fetus. Antibodies have the capacity to neutralize and mark foreign proteins, and they are a primary line of defense. Since a male fetus expresses proteins that are completely foreign to the mother, this can elicit an antibody immune response in the mother. This may be one reason why male fetuses are more likely to die than females before birth. Newborn males with older sisters are larger than male babies with older male siblings. Brain development abnormalities occur more commonly in male babies that have older male siblings. In addition, males are more likely to be left-handed than females and homosexual males are more likely to be left-handed than heterosexual males. Although left-handedness is obviously not a disorder, it is thought to reflect somewhat atypical patterns in brain development. I must emphasize, however, that the maternal immune response hypothesis is just that--a hypothesis. It's certain that an immune response occurs, but it has not been directly demonstrated that this immune response actually causes the fraternal birth order phenomenon. It is important to note that sometimes an oldest male child in a family can be homosexual, so the birth order phenomenon clearly does not explain all homosexuality.

My friend has a gay dog. No kidding. That thing rapes any male dogs that come around.

[SoonerCoug]

Originally Posted by BlueHair

Maybe the George Costanza method could also be employed. Show them a picture of a naked man and if "it" moves, he's gay.

That's fine for the women folk, but what about us men? My ex-wife used to beg me to wear a dress, but not till after we got married. I wish she would have told me about that fantasy before we went to the temple.

[SoonerCoug]

My wife and I work around mice a lot, and we always see males humping each other. And some of the males are just plain impotent with the females. We hypothesize that these are the gays.

[il Padrino Ute]

Originally Posted by SoonerCoug

My wife and I work around mice a lot, and we always see males humping each other. And some of the males are just plain impotent with the females. We hypothesize that these are the gays.

How many of those presumed gay mice have posters of Mickey instead of Minnie hanging in their cages?

[SoonerCoug]

Originally Posted by il Padrino Ute

How many of those presumed gay mice have posters of Mickey instead of Minnie hanging in their cages?

It's probably just a prison environment phenomenon (males are caged with other males, etc).

[BlueHair]

Originally Posted by SoonerCoug

That's fine for the women folk, but what about us men? My ex-wife used to beg me to wear a dress, but not till after we got married. I wish she would have told me about that fantasy before we went to the temple.

Gay women are harder to detect. The mullet haired flannel wearing lesbians are easy. I suggest asking a spouse-to-be to make out with a hot chick. If she'll do it, enjoy the show, then walk away.

[il Padrino Ute]

Originally Posted by SoonerCoug

It's probably just a prison environment phenomenon (males are caged with other males, etc).

I see. A kind of "get what you can" thing.

[YOhio]

Originally Posted by SoonerCoug

My wife and I work around mice a lot, and we always see males humping each other. And some of the males are just plain impotent with the females. We hypothesize that these are the gays.

I don't want to ruin your family fun, but you may want to consider a trap or maybe some cyanide to rid your house of the pervert mice.

[il Padrino Ute]

Originally Posted by YOhio

I don't want to ruing your family fun, but you may want to consider a trap or maybe some cyanide to rid your house of the pervert mice.

Peanut butter works better than cheese for this.

[RC Vikings]

Originally Posted by SoonerCoug

That's fine for the women folk, but what about us men? My ex-wife used to beg me to wear a dress, but not till after we got married. I wish she would have told me about that fantasy before we went to the temple.

So this women wants to marry a guy who has never masturbated before yet at some point she is going to ask him to put a dress on. I can't imagine their are to many guys out there like that.