I wonder if this guy setback the church - Page 2 - cougarguard.com — unofficial BYU Cougars / LDS sports, football, basketball forum and message board

Venkman · 08-01-2007, 09:37 PM

My dad grew up with George P. Lee. Said he was a great kid. Poster child for the success of the Indian Placement Program. It's sad what's become of him.

MikeWaters · 08-01-2007, 09:40 PM

sounds like the Indian Placement program was a resounding non-success.

Good intentions, but it comes across like a terrible idea in 2007.

Venkman · 08-01-2007, 09:55 PM

I think it was a success in many respects. I knew kids in the program, and they certainly benefitted from an educational standpoint. Two were twin brothers, and I know they went on missions and graduated from college. This probably wouldn't have happened without the IPP. But I think many were offended by the whole concept from a cultural standpoint, thinking the Church was trying to make white folks out of the Indians. And maybe they were right, I really don't know.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_Placement_Program

Jeff Lebowski · 08-01-2007, 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

sounds like the Indian Placement program was a resounding non-success.

Good intentions, but it comes across like a terrible idea in 2007.

Can I make another pitch here for a great book? You should check out "The Miracle Life of Edgar Mint" by Brady Udall.

http://www.amazon.com/Miracle-Life-E...6005816&sr=8-2

It is a novel about a young Navajo that was put in the Indian Placement program. Udall is LDS but the book was not written for an LDS audience (which is good, IMO). But the LDS angle made it quite interesting for me. Funny, poignant, and moving at the same time. And it has one of the best opening lines in a novel that I can remember.

OrangeUte · 08-01-2007, 10:48 PM

That mugshot might be as bad as nick nolte's.

I remember when George Lee was called to the Seventy. I had some very close friends who were Navajo, and it was so exciting for them to have a Lamanite called to the presiding quroums of the Church. Those people were devestated afterwards, as I'm sure many Native American members of the church were.

I wonder sometimes if the leadership of the church remains an "old boy's network" so that the church can try to avoid mishaps such as George Lee. I would imagine there is a certain amount of safety (for lack of a better word) in calling close friends and associates of other GA's to the presiding quorums.

Mormon Red Death · 08-02-2007, 01:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

sounds like the Indian Placement program was a resounding non-success.

Good intentions, but it comes across like a terrible idea in 2007.

that reminds me of an old pat bagley cartoon. basically it had the lone ranger with his arm around tonto with a nice family in the background. the caption said "c'mon tonto give the indian placement program a chance"

cougjunkie · 08-02-2007, 01:41 AM

this is from his daughter:

Hmmm, not too sure what to say other than it must have been a slow news day today. In defense of the church, they excommunicated my father for his apostate views. The allegations of abuse came after his excommunication. The church, along with the rest of us, did not know of the abuse at the time. Hence, contrary to some beliefs, there was no cover up on the church's part. And, as far as my father is concerned, for all those advocates of eternal punishment or those who question God's justice, my father has suffered and is still suffering in every way imaginable (physically, mentally and spiritually) for his past sins.

Any guesses on who wrote this (not sure if its who i suspect but a good impersonation)

Reservation of education. He saw fire , rain, sunnydays he thought would never end, great family wife , kids went on missions but it was the act. The brother was on a high wire and when he fell, the whole world watched, been told he is disalusional..how come everybody else knew where he was as that mormon grapevine tries to run everybody else's life. The young girl was very brave as I watched this played out and witheld my judgement. Now all that remains of this man are the shattered pieces caused by one of the deadly sins.I was told he even tried to start his own church at one pt. It is a sickness or demon which comes out in all religions, races and creed but it is the families that pay.Funny I have to pray for my and loved one protection from some members of this faith as it is so dominant that they have told my children we are going to hell because we don't go to church and this is just the children. But if heaven is run anything like it is in SE utah ..then i don't want no part of it and I'll meet the creator with my death song, eagle feathers and sage. But thanks to all the members who are tolerant, respectful and understand.It is sad to see when the legend dies.But LIBERAL TED I base my opinions on fact..Utah was the last state to allow Native Americans to Vote (1957), Within the last five years San Juan County was told to stop and desist the practice of not putting Native Americans in the Jury pool by the Justice Dept.It took a Native American to correct something the righteous wouldn't.List goes on and on. You lost the Navajo Mtn school case after your own lawyer told you your chances of winning and had to build it, without the Native money your kids wouldn't have the quality of education nor the current health system which the two towns with high numbers of your faith literally fought over.It makes some of us who live in the south part of the county question where's the love these guys talk about? Thank goodness wisdom prevailed but the question remains..if you can't get it together with harmony amongst the members of these two towns which if they worked together, they could have so much more by following what you preach who knows. Alot of natives see the double standards that you try to lay down so now the Navajo tribe will have a meetin in the fall over these issues as well as others. But it is true these issues can be resolved by working on all sides but the double standards don't cut it. By the way it isn't about being liked it is about doing what's right.Rage AGAINST the MACHINE thanks for your imput as it is being read by some members who are on the panel. That's why we pray just to make it today!

MikeWaters · 08-02-2007, 02:11 AM

I didn't know Native americans use grapevinian as well.

08-01-2007, 09:37 PM	#11
Venkman Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: South Jordan, UT Posts: 1,799	My dad grew up with George P. Lee. Said he was a great kid. Poster child for the success of the Indian Placement Program. It's sad what's become of him. Last edited by Venkman; 08-01-2007 at 09:39 PM.

08-02-2007, 01:41 AM	#17
cougjunkie Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Utah Posts: 5,741	this is from his daughter: Hmmm, not too sure what to say other than it must have been a slow news day today. In defense of the church, they excommunicated my father for his apostate views. The allegations of abuse came after his excommunication. The church, along with the rest of us, did not know of the abuse at the time. Hence, contrary to some beliefs, there was no cover up on the church's part. And, as far as my father is concerned, for all those advocates of eternal punishment or those who question God's justice, my father has suffered and is still suffering in every way imaginable (physically, mentally and spiritually) for his past sins. Any guesses on who wrote this (not sure if its who i suspect but a good impersonation) Reservation of education. He saw fire , rain, sunnydays he thought would never end, great family wife , kids went on missions but it was the act. The brother was on a high wire and when he fell, the whole world watched, been told he is disalusional..how come everybody else knew where he was as that mormon grapevine tries to run everybody else's life. The young girl was very brave as I watched this played out and witheld my judgement. Now all that remains of this man are the shattered pieces caused by one of the deadly sins.I was told he even tried to start his own church at one pt. It is a sickness or demon which comes out in all religions, races and creed but it is the families that pay.Funny I have to pray for my and loved one protection from some members of this faith as it is so dominant that they have told my children we are going to hell because we don't go to church and this is just the children. But if heaven is run anything like it is in SE utah ..then i don't want no part of it and I'll meet the creator with my death song, eagle feathers and sage. But thanks to all the members who are tolerant, respectful and understand.It is sad to see when the legend dies.But LIBERAL TED I base my opinions on fact..Utah was the last state to allow Native Americans to Vote (1957), Within the last five years San Juan County was told to stop and desist the practice of not putting Native Americans in the Jury pool by the Justice Dept.It took a Native American to correct something the righteous wouldn't.List goes on and on. You lost the Navajo Mtn school case after your own lawyer told you your chances of winning and had to build it, without the Native money your kids wouldn't have the quality of education nor the current health system which the two towns with high numbers of your faith literally fought over.It makes some of us who live in the south part of the county question where's the love these guys talk about? Thank goodness wisdom prevailed but the question remains..if you can't get it together with harmony amongst the members of these two towns which if they worked together, they could have so much more by following what you preach who knows. Alot of natives see the double standards that you try to lay down so now the Navajo tribe will have a meetin in the fall over these issues as well as others. But it is true these issues can be resolved by working on all sides but the double standards don't cut it. By the way it isn't about being liked it is about doing what's right.Rage AGAINST the MACHINE thanks for your imput as it is being read by some members who are on the panel. That's why we pray just to make it today! __________________ LINCECUM!

08-01-2007, 09:40 PM	#12
MikeWaters Demiurge Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 36,368	sounds like the Indian Placement program was a resounding non-success. Good intentions, but it comes across like a terrible idea in 2007.

08-01-2007, 09:55 PM	#13
Venkman Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: South Jordan, UT Posts: 1,799	I think it was a success in many respects. I knew kids in the program, and they certainly benefitted from an educational standpoint. Two were twin brothers, and I know they went on missions and graduated from college. This probably wouldn't have happened without the IPP. But I think many were offended by the whole concept from a cultural standpoint, thinking the Church was trying to make white folks out of the Indians. And maybe they were right, I really don't know. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_Placement_Program

08-01-2007, 10:48 PM	#15
OrangeUte Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 748	That mugshot might be as bad as nick nolte's. I remember when George Lee was called to the Seventy. I had some very close friends who were Navajo, and it was so exciting for them to have a Lamanite called to the presiding quroums of the Church. Those people were devestated afterwards, as I'm sure many Native American members of the church were. I wonder sometimes if the leadership of the church remains an "old boy's network" so that the church can try to avoid mishaps such as George Lee. I would imagine there is a certain amount of safety (for lack of a better word) in calling close friends and associates of other GA's to the presiding quorums.

08-02-2007, 02:11 AM	#18
MikeWaters Demiurge Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 36,368	I didn't know Native americans use grapevinian as well.