The "Gun Show Loophole" - cougarguard.com — unofficial BYU Cougars / LDS sports, football, basketball forum and message board

MikeWaters · 04-09-2009, 03:01 PM

I saw this on dailybeast, Holder being interviewed by Couric. Sorry I can't post a direct link, as I can't find a direct link. http://www.thedailybeast.com/video/

Anyway, good ol' Katie asks him about the "gun show loophole." And Holder is non-committal about getting rid of it.

So let me explain what this so-called loophole is. Because there ISN'T a loophole.

In this country it has always been legal (at least in jurisdictions that I am aware of) for a person to sell a gun to another person. My father owns a rifle. He gives it to me. I don't have to get a background check, I don't have to file paperwork, it is a private sale. Say my father wants to sell that rifle to his friend. Same thing, money is exchanged and now that friends owns the rifle.

My father could also attend a gun show, bring that rifle, sling it on is shoulder with a price tag attached, and sell it to another person. No background check, no registration, no paperwork.

However if my father is a licensed firearms dealer, then YES he has to do the background check and paperwork. All licensed dealers at gun shows or any other locale have to do this.

Private citizens do not. So when they talk about eliminating the "gun show loophole" they are talking about eliminating private sales. They are talking about eliminating a father giving a rifle to his son, without federal registration.

And what is so useful about federal registration of all firearm transactions? Well, then you have a list go collecting all the guns. Registration first, confiscation next. We've seen it in history (recent history even) many times.

Well, you ask, if a gun is used in a crime, how is it tracked? A gun has a serial number attached to it. The serial number is traced from the manufacturer to the dealer it was shipped to. From there it is traced to other dealers, or if the first dealer sold it to an individual, it is traced to him/her. And from there, an investigation with that individual and subsequent individuals. By the way, it is not very hard for a criminal to destroy the serial number on a gun.

Of course, Katie Couric is not going to explain all of this. Because she is dishonest. Because misleading scare tactics and lies work. Because the truth actually takes some time to ingest and understand, but lies are like cotton candy, you can just inhale.

Cali Coug · 04-09-2009, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

I saw this on dailybeast, Holder being interviewed by Couric. Sorry I can't post a direct link, as I can't find a direct link. http://www.thedailybeast.com/video/

Anyway, good ol' Katie asks him about the "gun show loophole." And Holder is non-committal about getting rid of it.

So let me explain what this so-called loophole is. Because there ISN'T a loophole.

In this country it has always been legal (at least in jurisdictions that I am aware of) for a person to sell a gun to another person. My father owns a rifle. He gives it to me. I don't have to get a background check, I don't have to file paperwork, it is a private sale. Say my father wants to sell that rifle to his friend. Same thing, money is exchanged and now that friends owns the rifle.

My father could also attend a gun show, bring that rifle, sling it on is shoulder with a price tag attached, and sell it to another person. No background check, no registration, no paperwork.

However if my father is a licensed firearms dealer, then YES he has to do the background check and paperwork. All licensed dealers at gun shows or any other locale have to do this.

Private citizens do not. So when they talk about eliminating the "gun show loophole" they are talking about eliminating private sales. They are talking about eliminating a father giving a rifle to his son, without federal registration.

And what is so useful about federal registration of all firearm transactions? Well, then you have a list go collecting all the guns. Registration first, confiscation next. We've seen it in history (recent history even) many times.

Well, you ask, if a gun is used in a crime, how is it tracked? A gun has a serial number attached to it. The serial number is traced from the manufacturer to the dealer it was shipped to. From there it is traced to other dealers, or if the first dealer sold it to an individual, it is traced to him/her. And from there, an investigation with that individual and subsequent individuals. By the way, it is not very hard for a criminal to destroy the serial number on a gun.

Of course, Katie Couric is not going to explain all of this. Because she is dishonest. Because misleading scare tactics and lies work. Because the truth actually takes some time to ingest and understand, but lies are like cotton candy, you can just inhale.

No, they aren't talking about "eliminating private sales." They are talking about regulating private sales.

MikeWaters · 04-09-2009, 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cali Coug

No, they aren't talking about "eliminating private sales." They are talking about regulating private sales.

Do you know the meaning of the word "private"?

Cali Coug · 04-09-2009, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

Do you know the meaning of the word "private"?

In this context, the sale of guns by non-dealers.

MikeWaters · 04-09-2009, 03:33 PM

If sales are regulated, between individuals, they are no longer private sales.

This is a bright white line--a national registration scheme is what they want.

Support it if you think that the govt. ought to have a list of all gun owners, with a list of every gun.

If you want to know how this would work in Canda, see the recent example of Canada. Thankfully there are a few Canadians who have said "from my cold dead hands" and the registration is an expensive, useless failure. This would be multiplied by 1000 fold in the US.

Cali Coug · 04-09-2009, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

If sales are regulated, between individuals, they are no longer private sales.

This is a bright white line--a national registration scheme is what they want.

Support it if you think that the govt. ought to have a list of all gun owners, with a list of every gun.

If you want to know how this would work in Canda, see the recent example of Canada. Thankfully there are a few Canadians who have said "from my cold dead hands" and the registration is an expensive, useless failure. This would be multiplied by 1000 fold in the US.

Good idea. I will support it.

04-09-2009, 03:01 PM	#1
MikeWaters Demiurge Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 36,365	The "Gun Show Loophole" I saw this on dailybeast, Holder being interviewed by Couric. Sorry I can't post a direct link, as I can't find a direct link. http://www.thedailybeast.com/video/ Anyway, good ol' Katie asks him about the "gun show loophole." And Holder is non-committal about getting rid of it. So let me explain what this so-called loophole is. Because there ISN'T a loophole. In this country it has always been legal (at least in jurisdictions that I am aware of) for a person to sell a gun to another person. My father owns a rifle. He gives it to me. I don't have to get a background check, I don't have to file paperwork, it is a private sale. Say my father wants to sell that rifle to his friend. Same thing, money is exchanged and now that friends owns the rifle. My father could also attend a gun show, bring that rifle, sling it on is shoulder with a price tag attached, and sell it to another person. No background check, no registration, no paperwork. However if my father is a licensed firearms dealer, then YES he has to do the background check and paperwork. All licensed dealers at gun shows or any other locale have to do this. Private citizens do not. So when they talk about eliminating the "gun show loophole" they are talking about eliminating private sales. They are talking about eliminating a father giving a rifle to his son, without federal registration. And what is so useful about federal registration of all firearm transactions? Well, then you have a list go collecting all the guns. Registration first, confiscation next. We've seen it in history (recent history even) many times. Well, you ask, if a gun is used in a crime, how is it tracked? A gun has a serial number attached to it. The serial number is traced from the manufacturer to the dealer it was shipped to. From there it is traced to other dealers, or if the first dealer sold it to an individual, it is traced to him/her. And from there, an investigation with that individual and subsequent individuals. By the way, it is not very hard for a criminal to destroy the serial number on a gun. Of course, Katie Couric is not going to explain all of this. Because she is dishonest. Because misleading scare tactics and lies work. Because the truth actually takes some time to ingest and understand, but lies are like cotton candy, you can just inhale.

04-09-2009, 03:33 PM	#5
MikeWaters Demiurge Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 36,365	If sales are regulated, between individuals, they are no longer private sales. This is a bright white line--a national registration scheme is what they want. Support it if you think that the govt. ought to have a list of all gun owners, with a list of every gun. If you want to know how this would work in Canda, see the recent example of Canada. Thankfully there are a few Canadians who have said "from my cold dead hands" and the registration is an expensive, useless failure. This would be multiplied by 1000 fold in the US.