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03-04-2008, 05:32 PM | #1 |
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Tex, serious question. Does it bother you to align yourself with Lingo and the stuff he's spewing in this thread? Because, as you know, I have kind of admired you in an arcane sort of way.
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03-04-2008, 05:35 PM | #2 | |
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The response was to YOhio's reference to the effect of government-sanctioned apologies....that, true, they do not right past injustices, but they do allow for a measure of some soothing. The Missouri apology is the same way. Just because you didnt care about it doesnt mean others in the Church did not. I have a feeling many did. Perhaps you are asserting that everyone feels as you do and found the Missouri apology to be hollow and meaningless?
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03-04-2008, 05:45 PM | #3 | |
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Mormons today have no problems living in Illinois. Blacks today are still persecuted and discriminated against. If anything, the comparison is "ludicrous" because it shows just how inconsequential Mormon suffering was to black suffering in comparison. And yet, how did Mormon leaders react to the apology? With approval and thankfulness. Here is what President Hinckley said in conference in 2004: "We are pleased to note that on April 1 of this year, the Illinois House of Representatives unanimously passed a resolution of regret for the forced expulsion of our people from Nauvoo in 1846. This magnanimous gesture may be coupled with action taken by then Governor Christopher S. Bond of Missouri, who in 1976 revoked the cruel and unconstitutional extermination order issued against our people by Governor Lilburn W. Boggs in 1838." "These and other developments represent a most significant change of attitude toward the Latter-day Saints." If an apology meant that much to Mormons, what could it mean to blacks today? |
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03-04-2008, 05:47 PM | #4 | |
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03-04-2008, 05:50 PM | #5 |
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In general, if a certain resolution of an issue is totally irrelevant to one person, but highly relevant to another person, and both are asked if the issue should be resolved in that manner, it seems prudent that both should agree that such resolution is acceptable.
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03-04-2008, 05:13 PM | #6 |
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Maybe I am misunderstanding Lingo's logic, but is it analogous to say that as bad as the Jews had it in the Holocaust (and it was terrible), they are much better off overall today because the net result was an official Jewish state and re-occupation of their homeland? Please tell me I am missing Lingo's point entirely here.
It seems that any serious analysis of slavery should not be mitigated by the inclusion of a "hey, lets look on the bright side of things..." rationalization. Slavery ranks up there with the big boys in history.....inquisition, holocaust, stalin executing cossacks, and the serious Brady Bunch spin-off where Mike Brady runs for Congress.
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03-04-2008, 05:19 PM | #7 | |
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The Jews/Holocaust comparison sucks. Were it not for the Holocaust, Jewish families would have remained in their homes in Europe and been just fine. Also, I'm against the idea of paying reparations to the 4th-generation descendants of Holocaust victims, so there goes hoya's "RACIST!" screech. |
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03-04-2008, 05:22 PM | #8 | |
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03-04-2008, 05:25 PM | #9 | |
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Are you trolling?
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03-04-2008, 05:32 PM | #10 | |
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1. Your point about why "obsess" over the US variety of slavery strikes me as incredibly insensitive overly simplistic. Maybe you are purposely being obtuse, but it seems narrow-minded to advocate historical amnesia simply because similar problems exist elsewhere beyond our borders. One very good reason that we should keep race struggles in the public conscious is that, for better AND worse, it promotes dialogue and progress. yes, the progress can be slow, and yes, there are those on both sides of the argument that have agendas. But those in society who have no real voice still benefit by our collective awareness of slavery, racism, and other societal injustices. We arent anywhere near perfect as a country, though, I admit. we still have lots of work to do. 2. The Jews/Holocaust comparison--thanks for saying it sucks. Maybe it does, which is why I couched it beforehand. Your point seemed to be an "ends justifies the means" approach to slavery. While jews would have remained in Europe and been "just fine," I guess you are saying that those that live in Africa are, for the most part, not fine and unhappy? You could be right, I have no way of proving how people in Africa feel about living in Africa. I know plenty of Americans that are unhappy here, too. Doesnt mean that it is not a great place to live. I have a feeling many Africans are happy to live in their home countries. Also, had jews remained in Europe and been just fine, would there have been an Israel? I don't know. 3. Why would the US pay reparations to Holocaust victims? I know that there was a recent case in LA where a holocaust decendant living locally was able to procure lost art that the Nazi's stole during the War. The art recently surfaced in Europe and this woman staked her claim to it. But the US was not a party to the litigation. I cant imagine anyone asking the US to pay them for what happened in the Holocaust.
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