Him now, us next -- Amerika's cleansing projekt

[JohnnyLingo]

I find it odd the Waters and others downplay the danger of Bin Laden and other terrorists because they've only killed 2,000 or so Americans (at least on American soil).

But this whole Guantanamo thing is ultra scary even though only a relative handful of people have been affected by it.

[UteStar]

No question that Bin Laden and other terrorists are scary. But I also find it scary in how our people are treated and our rights often getting trampled. The story here is disturbing because people are not finding it surprising. We are now a country that either shoots first or puts people in jail before we really know what is going on...and we have 50% of the country saying that is the way to do things now.

Conservatives have complained for years about how the government is trying to control our lives...and now the government is in our lives more than ever before all in the name of 'national security.'

exUte was arguing a few months back that he would be fine if he was wiretapped if they thought he was doing something bad. I truly doubt it, but I hear that silly argument all the time. Fear is driving our country now and it leads to some bad decisions which is sad.

[BlueK]

Originally Posted by Tex

Insert negative anti-American remark here.

insert anything here to avoid the topic

[BlueK]

Originally Posted by UteStar

Thats pretty disturbing. Nice comment Tex...instead of a 'this will be a bashing US thread' why not comment on and give your thoughts?

This is a bizarre case...it will be interesting to learn more about it. And yes, it is scary that this can happen.

the reason it can happen is because the current administration's take on these things is that if "terrorism" is in the equation, Constitutional rights don't apply.

[BlueK]

Originally Posted by UteStar

No question that Bin Laden and other terrorists are scary. But I also find it scary in how our people are treated and our rights often getting trampled. The story here is disturbing because people are not finding it surprising. We are now a country that either shoots first or puts people in jail before we really know what is going on...and we have 50% of the country saying that is the way to do things now.

Conservatives have complained for years about how the government is trying to control our lives...and now the government is in our lives more than ever before all in the name of 'national security.'

exUte was arguing a few months back that he would be fine if he was wiretapped if they thought he was doing something bad. I truly doubt it, but I hear that silly argument all the time. Fear is driving our country now and it leads to some bad decisions which is sad.

exUte is CB's resident authoritarianism advocate. At least he's honest and consistent. It's hard to find a topic where ex's solution doesn't have something to do with the government exercising more power over us whether it be controlling gas prices or spying on ordinary citizens. Ex isn't a conservative by my definition because conservatives are supposed to be pro-free market and he very much distrusts the market.

[BlueK]

Originally Posted by JohnnyLingo

I find it odd the Waters and others downplay the danger of Bin Laden and other terrorists because they've only killed 2,000 or so Americans (at least on American soil).

But this whole Guantanamo thing is ultra scary even though only a relative handful of people have been affected by it.

This isn't about Guantanamo. We aren't talking about a foreign fighter picked up on the battlefield and shipped off to prison in Cuba. We're talking about an American citizen trying to do his duty being thrown in jail with no rights to counsel simply because the government has already decided that Constitutional rights don't apply to anything having to do with the war on terror, whether you're an American citizen or not. And while they grab and put away the American, the true terrorists walk.

[Tex]

Originally Posted by BlueK

insert anything here to avoid the topic

Psst, BlueK.

http://cougarguard.com/forum/showpos...55&postcount=7

[BlueK]

Originally Posted by BarbaraGordon

This is the shit that should scare us.

American citizen, fighting with the good guys, denied all the protection legally afforded him.

Never read his rights, informed of the charges or evidence, provided legal counsel, or allowed to contact anyone. Imprisoned 97 days. And in the end, when he's exonerated, nobody even blinks.

nah, move along, nothing to see here. If the army suspected he was a terrorist he probably was. And suspicion of terrorism is enough to throw away your Constitutional rights.

[Archaea]

Originally Posted by BlueK

nah, move along, nothing to see here. If the army suspected he was a terrorist he probably was. And suspicion of terrorism is enough to throw away your Constitutional rights.

The issue ticking me off is the time delay, they could have verified Vance's story very quickly, but the bureaucratic machine moved ever so slowly. Isn't this what the coordination efforts of the unPatriot Act supposed to effect? Coordination by and among our operating entities.

And the stupid way in which the military released the innocent, in fact honorable, bystanders.