Boston Herald article on Mormonism

[MikeWaters]

For as many members as the 7th day adventists have, I have only met one person (not including my mission outside the US) who I knew to be a SDA.

Maybe they are just very quiet about it.

So you mean 2% per year?

[MikeWaters]

I like Rodney Stark's quote (he's at Baylor) from the sltrib article:

"Already there are more Mormons than Jews," he says, "and we want to consider Judaism a major world religion."

I think it is silly to get too caught up in who is growing faster than whom. I can't recall anyone every speaking to this subject over the pulpit. At least in my local wards. Can't speak to Gen. Conf. since I can't remember them.

[pelagius]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

For as many members as the 7th day adventists have, I have only met one person (not including my mission outside the US) who I knew to be a SDA.

Maybe they are just very quiet about it.

So you mean 2% per year?

I assumed Hyrum meant 2% per year, but rereading his post maybe he meant 2% total over 15 years. If it is 2% over 15 years then I think we can easily reject that since total growth in the number of stakes is 47%. Although, I suppose it is possible that all that growth came internationally and none of it was domestic (but I doubt it).

[creekster]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

I like Rodney Stark's quote (he's at Baylor) from the sltrib article:


I think it is silly to get too caught up in who is growing faster than whom. I can't recall anyone every speaking to this subject over the pulpit. At least in my local wards. Can't speak to Gen. Conf. since I can't remember them.

But "major religion" is not the same thing as "religion with significant number of members." NUmber of members is one factor, but not exclsuive.

[SeattleUte]

Nobody is as dynamic as the Evangelists. They're like a cancer. Something like 250 million members and they really only coalesced into a discrete movement this century. I bet they're activity rate is a lot higher than Mormons too. Mormons' published numbers are largely cooked.

[Archaea]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

Nobody is as dynamic as the Evangelists. They're like a cancer. Something like 250 million members and they really only coalesced into a discrete movement this century. I bet they're activity rate is a lot higher than Mormons too. Mormons' published numbers are largely cooked.

And you know this by some internal audit to which you're privy?

Cooked has the appearance of intential deception. I don't doubt the numbers are inaccurate, given the situations in which the numbers arrrived. However, having been part of the numbers crew, as a clerk, significant effort is employed to arrive at accurate numbers. Numbers are important in determining funds from Salt Lake, and in determining leadership needs.

It has been my experience that the Church strives to improve its accuracy in terms of numbers. As far as financial probity is concerned, the Church has an exemplary record.

So either you're baiting or plain ignorant of the facts. Is there inaccuracy? Yes. Is it intentionally deceptive? Not by a long shot.

Record keeping is a messy business. Yes there were some weird recruitment techniques during the seventies, but those processes have been largely corrected.

I'd say the Church has one of the more accurate records of membership of any religious affiliation of its size or larger.

[BigFatMeanie]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

Nobody is as dynamic as the Evangelists. They're like a cancer. Something like 250 million members and they really only coalesced into a discrete movement this century. I bet they're activity rate is a lot higher than Mormons too. Mormons' published numbers are largely cooked.

As an EQ Secretary, we counted someone as "active" if they attended quorum meeting at least one time during the month. We reported the # of Elders not attending any quorum meeting during the month to the ward clerk who sent it to the stake clerk and so on up the line. This has been standard operating procedure in every ward/stake I've ever been in (Arizona, California, Utah, China, Thailand, Taiwan, Philippines).

We had 104 Elders and 112 prospective elders on the records in our ward. Averaged about 30 Elders and 0 prospective elders in Quorum meeting (and Primary/YM) each week which equates to a 26% "active" rate in West Jordan, Utah. The rate for Sac. Meeting would be higher because many people skip out after that meeting. I would guess a church-wide activity rate of between 20-25%.

I don't know what the actual published activity rates are (or if they are even published) but, like Archaea, I believe they are derived with best-effort reporting and not just arbitrarily cooked.

[jay santos]

Originally Posted by BigFatMeanie

As an EQ Secretary, we counted someone as "active" if they attended quorum meeting at least one time during the month. We reported the # of Elders not attending any quorum meeting during the month to the ward clerk who sent it to the stake clerk and so on up the line. This has been standard operating procedure in every ward/stake I've ever been in (Arizona, California, Utah, China, Thailand, Taiwan, Philippines).

We had 104 Elders and 112 prospective elders on the records in our ward. Averaged about 30 Elders and 0 prospective elders in Quorum meeting (and Primary/YM) each week which equates to a 26% "active" rate in West Jordan, Utah. The rate for Sac. Meeting would be higher because many people skip out after that meeting. I would guess a church-wide activity rate of between 20-25%.

I don't know what the actual published activity rates are (or if they are even published) but, like Archaea, I believe they are derived with best-effort reporting and not just arbitrarily cooked.

In the area of Utah County that I live in, we have over 90% activity as defined by attending one sacrament meeting per month.

[hyrum]

Originally Posted by pelagius

I assumed Hyrum meant 2% per year, but rereading his post maybe he meant 2% total over 15 years. If it is 2% over 15 years then I think we can easily reject that since total growth in the number of stakes is 47%. Although, I suppose it is possible that all that growth came internationally and none of it was domestic (but I doubt it).

Actually, I meant 15 years ago, 2% of the population said they were Mormon. Recently 2% of the population said they were Mormon. See, for example, Pew and Gallup surveys. So US growth has kept pace with US population growth despite faster population growth in Mormon families than the general population. So, again, my point was that there is an underlying problem of retention, didn't intend to start a war over the race with the Seventh-day Adventists.

[SteelBlue]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

For as many members as the 7th day adventists have, I have only met one person (not including my mission outside the US) who I knew to be a SDA.

Maybe they are just very quiet about it.

That's interesting. I'd think that being an MD you'd have met many, many Adventists by now. There are at least 15 in the hospital where I work. They are big on education and there are many, many of them working in healthcare.