conspiracy theories re: Clintons - Page 2 - cougarguard.com — unofficial BYU Cougars / LDS sports, football, basketball forum and message board

MikeWaters · 03-06-2008, 10:45 PM

I personally admire the Obama supporters. The fact that people are actually excited and inspired has to count for something.

Nobody was excited about any of the GOP candidates. Mitt "finger in the air" Romney, Ron "crazy uncle" Paul, Rudy "my children hate me" Giuliani, John "straight dick" McCain, Mike "my wife is a man" Huckabee.

UtahDan · 03-06-2008, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

I personally admire the Obama supporters. The fact that people are actually excited and inspired has to count for something.

Nobody was excited about any of the GOP candidates. Mitt "finger in the air" Romney, Ron "crazy uncle" Paul, Rudy "my children hate me" Giuliani, John "straight dick" McCain, Mike "my wife is a man" Huckabee.

These are all the same people that made Britney Spears famous. They are consumers of pop culture. Obama is the pop icon of the moment. I am starting to feel optimistic lately that he might get nominated. The more I think about it the more I believe that he can't truly trade punches once the press stops treating him with kid gloves. Hillary, of course, can trade punches with anyone.

woot · 03-06-2008, 10:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UtahDan

Hillary, of course, can trade punches with anyone.

Except for the pop icon, apparently.

Criticizing a politician for being popular seems a bit like criticizing your math teacher for being good at math.

UtahDan · 03-06-2008, 11:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woot

Criticizing a politician for being popular seems a bit like criticizing your math teacher for being good at math.

Its not a critique. It is an explanation about why people are excited. It is excitement at a very superficial level. The grown ups interested in politics aren't "excited" because politics in general is a fairly sober topic.

I defy anyone to name me an exciting Obama position. "Yes we can" and "hope" don't count.

woot · 03-06-2008, 11:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UtahDan

Its not a critique. It is an explanation about why people are excited. It is excitement at a very superficial level. The grown ups interested in politics aren't "excited" because politics in general is a fairly sober topic.

I defy anyone to name me an exciting Obama position. "Yes we can" and "hope" don't count.

His plan to run a "google government" is pretty exciting to me. I think the whole strategy of criticizing Obama because he's popular among the under-30 crowd and because he's an effective speaker is just really stupid. If McCain or Hillary could, they would choose to be eloquent and popular with the under-30 crowd. They can't, so they try to make those qualities seem undesirable.

UtahDan · 03-06-2008, 11:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woot

His plan to run a "google government" is pretty exciting to me. I think the whole strategy of criticizing Obama because he's popular among the under-30 crowd and because he's an effective speaker is just really stupid. If McCain or Hillary could, they would choose to be eloquent and popular with the under-30 crowd. They can't, so they try to make those qualities seem undesirable.

A website that helps people understand where the federal budget gets allocated. This is his big idea? Wow I guess he really shot for the moon on that one. Of course Obama is eloquent, he is just remarkably non-specific. He has yet to articulate an idea other than withdraw from Iraq no matter what, which is just plain dumb. Even Hillary has a nuanced position on that.

woot · 03-06-2008, 11:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UtahDan

A website that helps people understand where the federal budget gets allocated. This is his big idea? Wow I guess he really shot for the moon on that one. Of course Obama is eloquent, he is just remarkably non-specific. He has yet to articulate an idea other than withdraw from Iraq no matter what, which is just plain dumb. Even Hillary has a nuanced position on that.

Clearly, this is something that should have been commonplace a long time ago, but compared to the current "everything is a secret" administration it's a good step forward. I haven't heard a lot of specifics from any of the candidates, but their websites tend to have a decent amount of them. I'm not part of the excited Obama crowd, but I don't find any of the most popular criticisms valid.

BigFatMeanie · 03-06-2008, 11:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woot

Clearly, this is something that should have been commonplace a long time ago, but compared to the current "everything is a secret" administration it's a good step forward. I haven't heard a lot of specifics from any of the candidates, but their websites tend to have a decent amount of them. I'm not part of the excited Obama crowd, but I don't find any of the most popular criticisms valid.

The Federal Funding Accountability and Transparency Act (colloquially called a "Google Government") was signed by President Bush in 2006 - so your "everything is a secret" label is a bit odd.

The only thing Obama has done is pledged to sign an executive order directing federal entities to do a "timely implementation" of it. I give him credit for supporting the continued implementation of the FFATA (he was the only Dem. to sign the pledge put out by the libertarian Reason Foundation). don't give him credit for the idea, the content of the act itself, or the passing of the legislation. It's really stretching things to refer to the full implementation of the FFATA as "Obama's plan".

Cali Coug · 03-07-2008, 01:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigFatMeanie

The Federal Funding Accountability and Transparency Act (colloquially called a "Google Government") was signed by President Bush in 2006 - so your "everything is a secret" label is a bit odd.

The only thing Obama has done is pledged to sign an executive order directing federal entities to do a "timely implementation" of it. I give him credit for supporting the continued implementation of the FFATA (he was the only Dem. to sign the pledge put out by the libertarian Reason Foundation). don't give him credit for the idea, the content of the act itself, or the passing of the legislation. It's really stretching things to refer to the full implementation of the FFATA as "Obama's plan".

The bill you cited was sponsored by Obama. It is also known as the Coburn-Obama bill. Ironic you would point out the goodness of a law sponsored by Obama (attributing it to Bush) followed by a criticism that Obama hasn't done anything.

BigFatMeanie · 03-07-2008, 03:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cali Coug

The bill you cited was sponsored by Obama. It is also known as the Coburn-Obama bill. Ironic you would point out the goodness of a law sponsored by Obama (attributing it to Bush) followed by a criticism that Obama hasn't done anything.

I didn't attribute it to Bush - I said he signed it in 2006. You read what you wanted into that simple statement of fact.

The bill was introduced by Coburn, Obama, McCain, and Carper and was co-sponsored by 43 other Senators as I'm sure you know.

I still think it's disingenuous to call it "Obama's plan".

03-06-2008, 10:45 PM	#1
MikeWaters Demiurge Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 36,365	I personally admire the Obama supporters. The fact that people are actually excited and inspired has to count for something. Nobody was excited about any of the GOP candidates. Mitt "finger in the air" Romney, Ron "crazy uncle" Paul, Rudy "my children hate me" Giuliani, John "straight dick" McCain, Mike "my wife is a man" Huckabee.