We're screwed

[BlueK]

Originally Posted by Tex

I guess you missed the part in 2004 where the entire party swooped in to save Spector from Pat Toomey, including President Bush himself, and very conservative former senator Rick Santorum. Or the part where they nominated a centrist as their candidate for president in 2008?

What percentage of the Republican candidates were religious right types? You had McCain, Giuliani and Romney who weren't. Then you had Ron Paul. After that, every other guy was religious right (about a dozen of them), and Romney was trying to look like one as well. The only reason McCain got nominated is because the RR couldn't agree on anyone, and McCain was everyone's second choice. He was the nominee by default.

[MikeWaters]

"Mitt the Evangelical Mormon" was a disaster.

[Tex]

Originally Posted by BlueK

What percentage of the Republican candidates were religious right types? You had McCain, Giuliani and Romney who weren't. Then you had Ron Paul. After that, every other guy was religious right (about a dozen of them), and Romney was trying to look like one as well. The only reason McCain got nominated is because the RR couldn't agree on anyone, and McCain was everyone's second choice. He was the nominee by default.

And yet, he was nominated. He even made a dent back in 2000. If the Republican tent were as small as Arlen Specter would have you believe, none of those guys would've made it past square one.

Successful politicians and/or political movements are not built on watering down your message for the purposes of mass appeal. They are built on persuading people who might otherwise disagree with you that your position is the right/best one.

The Republican tent doesn't need to be bigger--it's plenty big and there's room to spare. It needs to re-establish what it stands for, and convince more people to come inside.

[Cali Coug]

Originally Posted by Tex

I guess you missed the part in 2004 where the entire party swooped in to save Spector from Pat Toomey, including President Bush himself, and very conservative former senator Rick Santorum. Or the part where they nominated a centrist as their candidate for president in 2008?

Those are the very examples being given by the conservative rank and file right now for "purifying" their party. Thank you for proving his point. The party that helped Specter in 2004 won lots of elections. This version of the party finds only 21% of Americans claiming they are affiliated with them.

[Tex]

Originally Posted by Cali Coug

Those are the very examples being given by the conservative rank and file right now for "purifying" their party. Thank you for proving his point. The party that helped Spector in 2004 won lots of elections. This version of the party finds only 21% of Americans claiming they are affiliated with them.

And the Republicans have taken a 3-point lead in the generic Congressional poll.

The party now is not so different from what it was in 2004, except it now has no public face (normal, when a party just lost the White House with no clear successor). Conservatives didn't kick Specter out of the party. He left it, a long time ago actually.

[Cali Coug]

Originally Posted by Tex

And the Republicans have taken a 3-point lead in the generic Congressional poll.

The party now is not so different from what it was in 2004, except it now has no public face (normal, when a party just lost the White House with no clear successor). Conservatives didn't kick Specter out of the party. He left it, a long time ago actually.

If you want to hang your hat on the generic congressional poll, feel free. Just keep repeating to yourself "everything is fine with the Republican Party, there is no cause for alarm."

You are right that the party isn't "so different" than the party in 2004. The only real difference is that the 2004 party pretended to care about moderates (for electoral purposes), whereas this party doesn't pretend to care at all. Frankly, I like this version much more. It ensures they won't take back any control anytime in the near future.

[Tex]

Originally Posted by Cali Coug

If you want to hang your hat on the generic congressional poll, feel free. Just keep repeating to yourself "everything is fine with the Republican Party, there is no cause for alarm."

I didn't say that either. I simply don't think your cataclysmic view represents reality.

Originally Posted by Cali Coug

You are right that the party isn't "so different" than the party in 2004. The only real difference is that the 2004 party pretended to care about moderates (for electoral purposes), whereas this party doesn't pretend to care at all. Frankly, I like this version much more. It ensures they won't take back any control anytime in the near future.

Except that it's leading 2008 presidential candidate for a time (Guiliani) and its eventual candidate were both moderates.

I'm not too worried about the change in power ... the pendulum always swings, and the Democrats are thankfully a self-correcting group. They dig their own grave about as fast as Republicans do.

[Snowcat]

Democrats road a tidal wave in to power by not being George Bush. Their public face is a gifted speaker. They are getting a pass from most media not named Fox (who is not trusted as being fair and balanced).

The message of the election was change, change, change. Now we are getting change. It may have been a good idea to really think about the changes that were going to happen.

It is certainly a change to leave the frying pan for the warmth of the fire.

[il Padrino Ute]

Originally Posted by Snowcat

Democrats road a tidal wave in to power by not being George Bush. Their public face is a gifted speaker.

Well, he's gifted as long as he has a teleprompter.

[Snowcat]

Originally Posted by il Padrino Ute

Well, he's gifted as long as he has a teleprompter.

To each is given a gift. Some have the gift of writing speeches, others have the gift of reading them.