04-30-2008, 01:31 PM | #81 | |
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04-30-2008, 01:57 PM | #82 | |
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Society has a right to place limits on what constitutes worship, and individuals can accept or reject whatever they want. If I see Jeremiah Wright pounding his pulpit (literally) about the evils of American foreign policy, I have a right to call that "not religion" and lobby/vote accordingly. Believe me, I've had plenty of people tell me what a farce MY religion is.
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04-30-2008, 02:24 PM | #83 | |
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04-30-2008, 02:41 PM | #84 | |
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In that realm, individuals (rather than the state) can absolutely define what is a legitmate religious experience and what isn't. I don't know that I "resent" that others have discounted my experiences--that is their right too. They and I disagree, and hopefully we do so politely. But it's my right to hold my opinon their church isn't true, or their beliefs are false, or that their "Spirit" is a fabrication, or whatever. And to say so. Politics and religion make poor bedfellows. People have gotten their pants in a twist CONSTANTLY over the perception that George Bush (allegedly) might think he has divine approval. I didn't see you mounting your white horse on his behalf. In the case of Jeremiah Wright, it's even easier. The man clearly has a political agenda and is unafraid to leverage his religion to push it. It's my, or Arch's, or anyone else's "right" to call that for what it is. I don't need to justify my "right" to do so to Kite, you, or anyone else.
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"Have we been commanded not to call a prophet an insular racist? Link?" "And yes, [2010] is a very good year to be a Democrat. Perhaps the best year in decades ..." - Cali Coug "Oh dear, granny, what a long tail our puss has got." - Brigham Young |
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04-30-2008, 03:10 PM | #85 | ||
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Mankind uses religion, if used politically, for oppression and for a call to authority. Egypt, Sumeria, Greece, Rome, China, Japan, Islam, the Crusades, the Mayans, the Aztecs, the Incans and so forth. Mixing religion with politics is always ultimately grounds for oppression and overriding reason with emotion. It is doomed to failure every time. I call bullshit on anybody who tries to argue otherwise. Who are the three sociologists using grand narratives? I may have built in ironies, or contradictions if you understood what I was implying. Check out Auguste Comte, Karl Marx, Herbert Spencer, Emile Durkheim, Max Weber, Georg Simmel, and Vilfredo Pareto. You can skip Weber if you don't like him.
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Ἓν οἶδα ὅτι οὐδὲν οἶδα Last edited by Archaea; 04-30-2008 at 03:27 PM. |
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04-30-2008, 03:11 PM | #86 |
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I look upon Moses as an allegory for the Christ figure. We do not know if Moses existed, or if he existed in the form which tradition relates.
However, as a symbol he is powerful for the religious imagery of a salvific figure rising up out of the desert to instruct in the law of salvation.
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04-30-2008, 03:28 PM | #87 | |
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Now it's hard to take you seriously. That the Exodus story is allegorical (and I don't believe it is) just bolsters my point. "It didn't really happen, but we need a story about liberation from oppression." There was a great deal of human action in the event (midwives, Pharoah's daughter, the birth of a leader from among the elite). The Exodus story is what powered the abolitionist impulse of American Jews. It's liberation theology that formed the ideological underpinnings for the civil rights movement.
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04-30-2008, 03:30 PM | #88 | |
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04-30-2008, 03:50 PM | #89 |
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And you wonder why Seattle questions your approach.
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04-30-2008, 03:52 PM | #90 | |
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The civil rights movement was necessary and would have eventually happened no matter what.
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